- This topic has 18 replies, 6 voices, and was last updated 13 years, 2 months ago by
.
-
Posts
-
Hello once again! We are planning another Singapore order and I was wondering if anyone of you would be interested in the following:
“Blue Line Licorice Gourami” Parosphromenus Sp. Blue Line
“Moon Spot Licorice Gourami” Parosphromenus Linkei
“Ornate Licorice Gourami” Parosphromenus ornaticauda
“Paradise Licorice Gourami” Parosphromenus Deissneri Real ! From Bangka Island !
“Green Speckled Licorice Gourami” Parosphromenus Sintangensis
“Filament Licorice Gourami” Parasphromenus FilamentosusPlease feel free to contact me via email at sales@wetspottropicalfish.com if you are. The order has been planned for next Thursday the 20th. I would need to know by Tuesday the 18th if you want any of these. Thanks!
-Anthony
Anthony, you should place this in our American-category, too, because it’s likely that most of your customers will be friends of these fish in the US.
Most remarkable is that r e a l deissneri seem to be included! If they don’t confuse the animals with bintan from Bangka (which is possible), then the given location “from Bangka” seems to be plain and clear!
By the way: We work on a new system of fish-dstribution, using the button “distribution” in our main-menue. When it is ready, we can tell for example your address at this place as somebody who for the US-market often tries to have import-licorice-gouramis in his stock. But it will take some time, still.I can tell you that in Copenhagen, – during the last year, on two occasions – in one of the really good shops, where they often have good paro’es, – there has been a species with the label ‘Deissneri’ – wildcaught from Bangka. These have not been the ‘real’ deissneri.
What they are precisely is not yet clear, – but they look bintan like.This one certainly look a lot more like a real deissneri than the ones I have seen in the shop in Copenhagen.
I do know that most often its not the real one, even shops say they are, – but this particular shop has had many ‘correct’ species such as parvulus, nagyi, ornaticauda. And they do maintain that the ‘Bangka deissneri’ is wildcaught at Bangka. However, they are not like the one you have shown in the picture.
That looks to me like the real one 🙂 How interesting and good.No, I am very sorry, but Anthony’s picture does not display the real deissneri. It’s displaying a fish of the bintan-group with a slightly pointed caudal fin and some brownish-reddish tinge in it’s unpaired fins.
To compare with deissneri please refer to our species account and the pictures over there. Even when very young the deissneri-males have a markedly pointed caudal fin with a black filament just similar to filamentosus. Even the females have a short filament but not as long and conspicous as in the males. The hyaline stripes in the dorsal and anal fins of the males are completely broken up into single short stripes standing much more upright. The most typical is that marking in the caudal: Never a continous band, always the characteristically distinct short stripes which run strictly parallel.
Anthony: Is your picture intended to show us the fish that is offered as “deissneri from Bangka”? Then this offer will not be deissneri. But perhaps the picture is really an old one used for illustration purposes by your partner in Asia. Then, it must remain an open question whether the “deissneri from Bangka” in the new offer will really be deissneri. The fish offered may well be caught on Bangka. There is bintan occurring on Bangka and there is some rumour about a third species of a bintan-like form. But maybe it’s deissneri. That is possible, of course. But then it must be another fish than shown on this photo.🙂 Thank you Peter for correcting me, – that shows you how difficult this identification is, – even I should know better, I forget to look for the ‘true’ identification mark as you mention about the band in the tail. Maybe I just wanted it to be a real deissneri for once 🙂 …
Hi
this is the stock pic that the exporter uses for “deissneri” on their stock list
cheers
Colin[IMG]http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c213/cornuta/image019.jpg[/IMG]
may I know where and how to get to contact the seller? I’m from Malaysia, just north of Singapore, thanks
I refer to the picture that Colin gave us here. He says that this is the original picture of the fish called “deissneri” that the exporter used. Well, well! Or better: not well! It’s a background reminding of a detective story.
This picture was taken by Hans-Joachim Franke as one of a well-known series that he shot in the seventies of the fish he received from Dr. Walther Foersch. Franke, at that time a famous specialist for labyrinths in the GDR, was in contact with Foersch in Munich and was lucky to get some of this fish, because the GDR was a closed communist state. Foersch was the first to discover the real breeding conditions of these fish. He had received his fish from Dietrich Schaller (“Trichopsis schalleri”), who caught them after having adviced by Eric Alfred (at that time head of the Raffles Museum Singapore) at Ayer Hitam. At that time this was one of the few places known for the occurrence of P. “deissneri”, as they were called. Later on, many people caught these fish at this place. As Kottelat and Ng tell us 2005 (in their publication containing the last up to now decribed six species, including P. tweediei) the fish from Ayer Hitam belonged to what we today call P.tweediei. There are some open questions with this description, however, referring to the variability of tweediei: it seems to be markedly greater than stated by Kottelat and Ng. The fish Foersch had (which I saw there with him) and which Franke received form him (and others too, in fact I received a pair, too) were obviously such a variant of what we today call tweediei, at that times they were called (as others) “deissneri”. By the way: Today Ayer Hitam is completely destroyed.
Therefore the exporter uses a very old photo of a fish that shows a variant of tweediei, but definitely not the fish we call deissneri today. Obviously he makes no difference between some very distinct Parosphromenus-species with round caudal fin and calls all of them (as all of us did in former times) “deissneri” (and so does most of the trade till the present day, but we should not continue this practice). Today, the male real deissneri is well-defined and clearly distinguished from all others at first sight by the publication of Kottelat and Ng from 1998 (describing bintan and redescribing deissneri); look at our species account.
Therefore, either the picture shows the fish which the exporter sells, then it is not deissneri. Or he only gives a nice photo of a nice fish (following the motto: Well, you should not make such a fuss about it, they all look very similar), and then the question must be open what species he sells with this false name. He states that the fish come from Bangka island. So, if this at least is true: There are at least two species occuring, bintan and deissneri. The males are completely different, to be seen at the first sight. But his picture shows neither the one nor the other. P. bintan is excluded by colour, P. deissneri is excluded by structure,too. The most likely explanation is that the fish offered is one of the many “other forms” which are somewhat bintan-like. But the picture does not help us to solve the puzzle.
A Parosphromenus detective story …
A word to C.Way: contact Anthony that he tells you the exporter.[quote=”kindai” post=519]wau..really nice to know can get the paros near by..:)[/quote]
good chance to pair up your single P. “Blue-Line” female and get them spawning :), hopefully it is possible to channel a few pair over for breeding purposes 🙂
I think you have certainly highlighted a problem Peter, which was my original intention by posting the photograph…
It is very difficult to accurately buy and then sell many of the Paro. species available and give a true name for the species on offer. Personally I am not complaining as I have become accustomed to this and usually have to employ a bit of detective work. I
I promise to take some pics of the “deissneri” I have today and this evening I should be taking delivery of sumatranus and linkei so lets see what that brings 🙂
Colin
PS This is not just a Paro problem – My Parasphaerichthys lineatus were sold as ocellatus and often Bettas are not quite the exact species sold either.
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.