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That’s rather exciting news!
I know that my local fish dealer generally doesn’t order from Ruinemans and will not do it as a favour. So – is there any other way to get some of the fish? I have absolutely no experience with wholesalers …….. Is there any chance that e.g., Tropicwater will get some of the fish so that an order for me as private person would be possible? Or is there a chance that a member of the project gets his hands on a good lot of the fish and is able to distribute them here in Germany?
(I am interested in any paro species – but gunawani has been one of my favourites from the beginning. And it would be interesting to compare true gunawani females to my “mystery girls” which might resemble this species)
Hello, Bill,
no, I don’t think I have more than one batch of fry. I had already recognized the fry before but made only bad photos then – so I couldn’t make the birth announcement earlier, at the right time.I think now there’s another clutch in the cave. Normally the female is not to be seen, she is hiding in the back of the tank, while he guards his cave and surroundings near the front. But yesterday she was there, with a rounded belly, and visited him in his cave…………..
I don’t look into the cave very often to leave the fish undisturbed but I had the impression of only small clutch size, about 20 eggs or so. You have to keep in mind that the fish are still young, the size of the clutch might increase in the future.A bit off-topic, but to contribute to Helene’s question: I keep my Betta hendra pair in a 16 liter tank with very much floating plants, hanging roots, and leaf litter. Enough coverage for the female to hide if necessary. I have them since November, and the male now guards their third bubble nest/clutch at minimum. Young Betta in all sizes swim around – and this picture was taken today:
I have the strong impression that they’re doing quite well …. even in this small tank ….
And to get back to the main topic: The only paros I have which breed and breed and breed and never had any fry since over a year – are my P. nagyi ……………
So – now here’s the birth announcement Bill was hoping for ………… The “baby” on the picture (one the right at about one o’clock, above the male in his cave) is definitely not “newborn”. But I only had bad pictures of the very young fry, not sharp at all. So the birth announcement is a bit late – but nevertheless …………..
Yes, Helene, that sounds logical: survival of the fittest may in this case be survival of the quickest. And she only gets those which dare to be seen ………. or are fools enough to be discovered. There are fry which constantly hide in the Microsorum “bushes”, others stay underneath the leaf litter. She can’t get those – they dart away under cover as soon as she appears. She only gets the ones that move slowly along the panes of the tank without any cover or “dream along” under the surface.
Thank’s for your answers, Helene and Bill.
Bill – I can’t say it for sure, but I don’t have the impression that there is something wrong with the fry or that she picks out only certain young. I see her “scanning” the hanging roots of the plants floating on the surface where the small fry like to hide. To me she is simply hunting – it doesn’t look different to hunting glass worms.
And as I said – the small fry are very secretive and obviously well aware of their dangerous mother. As they grow (too big to be swallowed) they lose their fear and swim freely right in front of their mother (which obviously checks whether they are still “edible” or not).Good Morning!
I just watched my quindecim displaying and took some photos which I would like to show. I find the courtship behaviour of quindecim rather interesting because it’s not only the male displaying his brightest colours in front of the female. In quindecim, the female “answers” the courting of the male by displaying herself. It’s sort of a back and forth: first he “flashes” in his brightest colours, fins spread, and moves sidewards towards her, while she moves backward looking at him in the same tempo he approaches her. Then she spreads her fins and moves sidewards towards him. First they display side by side, she moving in his direction and he drawing back in the same tempo, still displaying. Then he stops displaying and simply watches her displaying to him in the same way he did.
My rubrimontis and nagyi never show this sort of display of the female – I just watched in pahuensis, too.Here are some pictures. I am afraid the tank is not very clean – the courtship behaviour always seems to be very successful, I have young quindecim of all sizes in this tank and thus am too afraid to clean it thoroughly. And the young seem to feel well underneath the leaf litter and fibres ……
Thank you, Peter, for your estimation of the situation.
[quote=”Peter Finke” post=2818]
By the way: Stefanie’s fish remind me at the most of Parosphromenus gunawani, a bintan-like form from county Jambi on Sumatra, formerly called spec. Danau Rasau. It’s the body form which is similar, rather high-built and generally stout and strong.[/quote]Yes, you are right – it’s what I think everytime I see the well known picture of P. gunawani. It’s not the colouration – but the body shape is almost exactly the same.
Regarding colouration – there is one form in Horst Linkes newly edited book on labyrinth fishes, which shows a very similar colouration to my “fish in question”: P. “Palangan”. Here it’s the body shape and size (only up to 3,5 cm) which do not fit.
No matter if male of an unknown form or female with hyperdominant behaviour: it’s absolutely interesting!
Same question again – me having been completely sure to have three females in the last months. And now this….
The fish has occupied the cave, coming out from time to time to chase the same female (the third one doesn’t dare to show a single fin … She hides and is nowhere to be seen).
In the last hour I have tried to detect similarities to forms and species (looking through the illustrations of the new paro-books of Finke/Hallmann and of Linke). Not very successful …..
A few times the fish showed something like a display towards the female:
There is no iridiscent colour to be seen. The dorsal and anal fin show a very dark chestnut colour, looking almost black when in the “mood”:
Both fins show a black seam on the outer margin, in this picture to be seen in the anal fin::
The caudal fin shows a lighter band:
Here another “chase”, poor quality, but showing the sexy eyes and very dark fins of the questionable fish:
I can not say that I have a suspicion what form or species this might be. The fin colouration – chestnut without iridescence, but not anjunganensis. And as I said – these are no small, graceful paros. I must confess that to me the body shape is much stouter and sturdier than in any paro I have seen (most of them on photos).
And the question still (or again) is – male or female? I have never heard about a female being so dominant that she even shows sexy eyes, besides an unusual dark colouration, while chasing another female (and chasing only one of the two further females living in the tank).
What do you think?
Hello, Peter,
thanks for your extensive response. I am afraid, I do not know anything about the origin of the fish. I got them from a Czech dealer who claimed they came from “Asia” (how astounding!). He didn’t respond to my further questions ….
So I think I have no male with which I could try as you suggested.
But something occurred in the last hours which I would like to show you. I had the tank with the fish in another room for a while, but I took them back to my working room a few weeks ago. Now I can observe them more closely – which I did this afternoon, and made some photos.
Don’t blame me for bringing up the old question again – but look at these photos:
Is it possible that females show sexy eyes when chasing other females? Is this observed not only in courtship, but in aggressive behaviour, too? This one on the pictures is the one which was in question from the beginning – having a rather dark caudal fin colouration. The fish is sitting beneath some leaves near a bough most of the time. There is no cave in the tank – because it’s inhabited by females only. I now put in a cave – to see what happens………..
(Please excuse it if my photos are not quite good – my camera has a serious defect, showing broad bars in strange colourations and disrupted pictures. I show only the best pictures I can get now)
Hello to you all!
I just thought it might be nice to show some photos of my “mysterious girls” from the beginning of this thread. They are fully grown now, and I think I’ll show you some pictures of the adults. I have only three of them by now – I am ashamed to say that one of them got lost during moving to a new tank ……….. could’nt find her anymore despite of looking through all leaf litter and fibres I removed from the old tank ….
They have grown to very large, stout paros. Similar in size to my adult quindecim female but not as slim as quindecim, with a much higher body profile.
To me the fish look slightly different – so I think the one in the middle has noticeably long fin rays in the dorsal fin, which surmount the upper margin of the fin. Here another picture of this female:
Another female shows a black dot at the hind end of the dorsal fin, not very distinctive, but still visible:
I am very interested in what you think of the girls now ………… 😉
Yes, I got mine from a breeder here in Germany.
If yours are announced to be about 2,5 to 3,0 cm I supppose they will be not quite adult yet. Mine (now about 1,5 years old) measure about 3,5 cm.
It would be great if you could show some photos of your nagyi after they have acclimated to their new home.
Hello, Bill,
even though I am surely not the most qualified person to answer your question, I will try to give you a first answer by translating the P. nagyi-part of the new paro-book by Finke and Hallmann. I hope the authors will excuse possible ups and downs of my translation ……… :unsure:
Especially the forms of [i]P. nagyi from southern localities show a curiosity: The rim of the caudal is not pigmented but transparent. In the local forms from Kuantan and Pekan Nenasi the turquoise seam of the caudal fin is not located at the fringe of the caudal – which is different from all other species. Males in nuptial colouration seem to pretend to have shorter fins – an alleged contradiction to the accentuation of size and brightness of fins in paros.
So, we know two differentiable varieties : First, P. nagyi „Kuantan“, P. nagyi „Pekan Nenasi“ and further localities south of the terra typica, with white bands in the caudal fin and a prominent spot at the hind base of the dorsal fin.
Second, P. nagyi „Cherating“ with regular turquoise bands in all unpaired fins. The transparent fin margins/projecting fin rays, respectively, are, by far, not as distinctive as in the other forms. Thus, the caudal seems to be larger in P. nagyi „Cherating“.[/i]Maybe this can be a first step to explain the form “Pekan Nenasi”.
Here the transparent margin of the caudal in “Pekan Nenasi” is very well to be seen:
